[Lola]

So I know the basics of theory
And it has served me well! Am I wrong just to learn songs because I for one don't want to learn anymore theory at least the minute?

I know it's the old adage, more theory more knowledge but!

I find I am able to listen to my favorite song, deduce the tonic and the chords! Their is usually some type of technique in the song etc! I am not book smart when I comes to music but I know by listening and experimention that I will be able to get it. Book smarts doesn't motivate me at all.

 

[cboutilier]

Learn it one way; learn it both. In the long run they add together. The stuff you learned by the song will start to make sense with the theory you have learned. When you get to that point every thing seems to find a place in your mind puzzle to fit together.

 

[Hammerhands]

More of the right kind of theory makes learning songs easier, faster.

But don't let anything get you down, keep buggering on.

 

[shoretyus]

Psst ..Songs are practical applications of theory .... your still doing theory
%h(*&

 

[Budda]

Learn songs because you want to. Learn theory because you want to. There's no one forcing you to do any of it. Take a month off if you want to, you can do that too haha.

 

[Lola]

Learn songs because you want to. Learn theory because you want to. There's no one forcing you to do any of it. Take a month off if you want to, you can do that too haha.

Budda what I am try to say is, am I short changing myself because I am not advancing myself in theory??

 

[vadsy]

am I short changing myself because I am not advancing myself in theory??

Yes

 

[Budda]

Budda what I am try to say is, am I short changing myself because I am not advancing myself in theory??

Possibly. Many good musicians don't know any theory and make incredible music. Many other musicians know a lot of theory and also make incredible music.

Something you can do is find songs that you really like, and study the theory side of them. It's easier to learn something when you enjoy it.

 

[High/Deaf]

I think it's possible to write or play great sounding music with a good ear but no theory. I'm not sure the opposite is true. Music and math have a tight relationship but sometimes it's when you break the rules in music that makes the hook or memorable riff. Not true with math - you can't break the rules.

I've had someone tell me the A maj in a particular song can't be an A maj because the song is in G and the scale is blah, blah, blah. I couldn't argue against his rules because he had a lot more theory than me but I don't think you can always say a particular chord won't work with a particular key, either. So I guess while I think theory is a great tool to being a better musician, I don't think it should every over-rule your ear or what you hear in your head when writing. If it sounds right, math be damned. IMO.

 

[Chito]

Possibly. Many good musicians don't know any theory and make incredible music. Many other musicians know a lot of theory and also make incredible music.

Something you can do is find songs that you really like, and study the theory side of them. It's easier to learn something when you enjoy it.

You forgot to mention some musicians know a lot of theory but can't make music. Just saying.

 

[luker0]

After losing a guitar teacher who moved to Toronto and having him be replaced by another one who's opening sentence was "so what song are we going to play today", I made a conscious decision to step back and re-evaluate why I was learning to play guitar. I came to the conclusion that I did not just want to learn a couple of dozen songs and just play those over and over again like some of my friends do and start learning more theory AND the fret board. A musician friend of mine once said that if you know the circle of fifths and the fret board intimately you can play anything and that you can learn new songs a lot faster.

Since then I've slowed down my learning and started focusing on knowing what notes are where, understanding keys and modes, learning rhythms and rhythmic patterns, and learning to read sheet music. Also, spending a lot of time playing to a metronome or Band in a Box progressions. The ultimate goal is to be able to hear some one call out "12 bar blues in A" and to know what to do in that situation.

YMMV of course, because everybody plays for their own reasons.

 

[Lola]

Possibly. Many good musicians don't know any theory and make incredible music. Many other musicians know a lot of theory and also make incredible music.

Something you can do is find songs that you really like, and study the theory side of them. It's easier to learn something when you enjoy it.

That's exactly what I am doing. I am not getting out the theory books and slugging over them. I think that this is just a preconceived stupid thought on my part.

I play what I really love to play. That keeps my passion at a constant boil. For example I am learning Girls got rhythm by you know who(lol). There are double stops, bends, string skipping etc. To be able to learn this song the way I want to play it I have to learn all of the previously mentioned to be able to sound proficient at this song. Because it's Angus I give it my all. When you love something so much you naturally try harder. It upps my learning curve to new challenges. I practice so passionately because I want to be able to play this song so badly. I am starting to be able to string stuff together by myself to come up with good improve skills. I am not fast by any means but give me a key in some sort of blues rendition and then I can just let it fly. It's moments like these that tell me that sitting an being on automatic and practicing scales, techniques etc. wouldn't of done me much good anyways because it's just not the same as playing what you truly love to play. I just don't have it in me to just sit there and learn from a book. Book learning isn't as important as I thought was. I can just hear song in my head and just figure it out by ear.

I really like Mike Gross for guitar learning videos. He does the rock n roll classics that I love and grew up with. Fun!

 

[Hammerhands]

"I couldn't argue against his rules because he had a lot more theory than me..."

...

 

[shoretyus]

If it sounds right, math be damned. IMO.

The idea of learning scales is to know what right is. I hear what your saying about playing note you want, but unless the note is totally off the wall , it will fit into some musical rule .

 

[shoretyus]

Hey Lola .... fuel for your fire

 

[Lola]

Hey Lola .... fuel for your fire

Just the best effing Saturday night song ever. OMG you know I am just about to grab my guitar and go crazy.

You sir are the Blues Man! Just my style. This song is naughty but still nice! It has a low key growl to it. lol

I absolutely loved this. WOW!

I play a lot with just my ear. It rarely fails me.

This song "Born under a bad sign" follows a pattern. One that's so familiar to me. Not quite a 12 bar blues because the first eight bars are the 1 chord.

 

[Lola]

delete

 

[Lola]

I am still up learning all the little solo nuances that everyone is playing! I can add or subtract whatever I wish too.


Looking a Eric Clapton, Albert
king and a few others just to get some riff ideas

Day off so I really don't care when I sleep

 

[Dorian2]

I think it's possible to write or play great sounding music with a good ear but no theory. I'm not sure the opposite is true. Music and math have a tight relationship but sometimes it's when you break the rules in music that makes the hook or memorable riff. Not true with math - you can't break the rules.

I've had someone tell me the A maj in a particular song can't be an A maj because the song is in G and the scale is blah, blah, blah. I couldn't argue against his rules because he had a lot more theory than me but I don't think you can always say a particular chord won't work with a particular key, either. So I guess while I think theory is a great tool to being a better musician, I don't think it should every over-rule your ear or what you hear in your head when writing. If it sounds right, math be damned. IMO.

Well if this person actually new music theory, going as far back as who the hell knows when, then they'd realize that there are things called parallel chord substitutions as well (ie: subbing Am (ii in key of G) for A Major in this case).

As per the thread, theory is a 2 way street. If you apply what theory you know to your cover tunes or your own, and how everything basically relates to something else, you are on your way. It's a 2 way street insomuch that it is possible to get too bogged down with thinking about the relationships and not actually playing or applying them. Then they simply become time wasting excercises. Just apply it to what you do Lola, like a few have already mentioned. It'll open up other questions for you and it will indeed allow you to learn songs much more quickly.

There is no right or wrong. But it's easier to break the rules when you are aware of them.

 

[High/Deaf]

Yea, I know enough theory to keep me dangerous, but there are others who know more than me. I'm not going to argue with them about one chord in the chorus of Hot D0g because I can't be bothered and it's over in 3 minutes. It's just frustrating hearing his minor over my major (twice in the song) and know he will never go and listen to the recording because the root, fundamental, lydian mode, circle of 99s, transversal arpeggios, yada yada yada................

There's a lot of cool things that would have never been written or recorded if all we ever did was follow the rules. Like the Beano album.