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Discussion Starter #1
This thread is not for the tube heads. Yes, yes. I know that tube amps sound better. I'm not disputing that. OK? Now lets talk Pod.

I have a Pod XT and love its sound for recording and through headphones. I have performed with it going direct to a P.A. and that works pretty well, but often our gigs don't have enough P.A. for that to work effectively.

Guitars are an american strat with Fender noiseless pickups and a Godin Freeway Classic.

I can't afford a good tube amp. Wish I could, but I can't.

So, I'm thinking of putting together a stage rig based on the pod. I checked out the Atomic Amp and found it to be lacking in power, but it sounded pretty good.

The question is: What combination of speaker cabinet(s) and solid state power amp would give me results that are close to the recorded or headphoned sound of my Pod XT?

I thought that I might build two seperate 1X12 sealed enclosures and use something like the Crate Power Block, or maybe just a Carvin or Yamaha P.A. power amp, and my Pod XT as the front end. With two 1x12 cabs, I could go with one cab for smaller gigs and rehearsals, two cabs for larger gigs with the added benefit of being able to run the pod in stereo.

Discuss.
 

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get a yorkville powered speaker or 2 for stereo...the 250 watter should be fine. most music stores rent them, they are tuff and reliable.
 

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To get a sound closest to what you are achieving through headphones, you want to get an amplification setup that's as neutral as possible. Try to find a used P.A. system.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Pod amp

SCREEM said:
get a yorkville powered speaker or 2 for stereo...the 250 watter should be fine. most music stores rent them, they are tuff and reliable.
I'll look into that. Thanks.
 

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Man you guys kill me. He said he can`t afford a decent tube amp, but with the ideas I`ve read here, he can get a great tube amp for the price of some of the ideas here. I paid $350 for my Traynor Guitarmate, and it sounds better than a lot of boutique offerings, never mind a Pod and a used PA. And as much as I hate Blues Jr`s, I`d buy one of those before anything solid state.

CT.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
CocoTone said:
Man you guys kill me. He said he can`t afford a decent tube amp, but with the ideas I`ve read here, he can get a great tube amp for the price of some of the ideas here. I paid $350 for my Traynor Guitarmate, and it sounds better than a lot of boutique offerings, never mind a Pod and a used PA. And as much as I hate Blues Jr`s, I`d buy one of those before anything solid state.

CT.
You should read the original post of a thread before responding. I stated that I would prefer a good tube amp, but I don't have the bucks for a Fender Twin Reverb, Vibrolux or other high end tube amp. The amps you cited in your arguement are not by any stretch of the imagination more desireable that a POD/PA or Solid State amp solution. I grew up in the era of Traynors. Those amp sounded like crap. Any of the surviving Traynors from that period only sound good after having been heavily modified. The Blues Junior is a one trick pony with just enough power for rehearsal purposes.

I have run my pod through a PA in circumstances where the PA was big enough. Non-musicians complimented the sound. Musicians asked where I was hiding my Fender Twin Reverb. So, I know it is possible to get a more than acceptable sound this way.

My question is about what to do when the PA is not adequate and I must use stage amplication. I never asked your opinion about tube amps versus modellers. That's not what this thread is about.

To your point, I would say that there isn't a tube amp tha I like more than my Pod solution for less than $1000.00. The only one that has come close so far has been one of thos Vox hybrids for about $600.00. Since I already own the Pod, I'd rather spend a few hundred dollars for a solid state solution than $1000.00 on a tube amp.

Of course, in the time I'm taken to reply to you, I probably could have been out there earning money ... It's somewhat of a circular argument.

I'll tell you...I'm tempted to go out and buy myself a fender twin, just so that I don't have to listen to the tube heads whine...

Jeff
 

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A traynor sounds like crap!!??!!??
i have a Traynor guitar mate from 1969 that sounds fabulous.My 'heavily modified' changes?A celestion greenback speaker.
It has a nice reverb and tremelo and absolutely sounds amazing.

I found the biggest problem with some old traynor's was the speaker.The original Marseland speakers sounded nasal and weak.A good speaker and a service will cure most Traynor's ills and they sound better than a Blues jr,hot rod deluxe and most other of todays' tube amps.
I guess it realy depends on what kind of music you are playing and whether it's live or not.And you mentioned your guitars;a fender strat with noiseless pickups and a godin freeway classic.The fender sounds awfull to me,the godin is a keeper.You have access to a PA system when you gig and even a smaller tube amp would fill the bill when going through the PA system.How about a champ with a 12" speaker?
Plenty loud enough without the PA.With the PA? The sky's the limit.
www.claramps.com
 

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To be realistic,there are some good effects in a pod,but I would rather have it go into a good tube amp from the pod.We all use pedals to some extent and a Pod is just a glorified pedal,right?It's a tool like anything else.If it's used properly it will give satisfying results.If it's used totally solid state all through the chain,it can sound very digital and processed.some people actually like that tone.I don't personally,but we have to bend a little to experience new things once in awhile and not be closed minded to things.

www.claramps.com :DevilGuitar:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Disappointed

I'm disappointed that this thread turned into yet antoher tirade by the tube heads, instead of focusing in on the topic of my original post.

I was looking for help in finding the best solution to a particular problem. I never asked for your well known opinions on tubes vs. solid state. Guess I should have known better.

Bye.
 

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You've passed the initiation test!Seriously,the Crate power block is a good amplifier in itself and it is designed for the Pod to go into it.You can get any speaker designed for guitar amps,even a PA speaker and it will do what you need it to do.
Yes,we are a bunch of tube heads for sure.But there is a reason.Me in particular,I have gone down the road you are going down now.I used to have an effects processor and a Rack mounted solid state Rexx amplifier.It was plenty good enough for what I was doing with it at the time.As time went on,I 'discovered' tube amps.It really depends what you need.If you play lots of covers,you need effects of some kind.if you play the blues,you need a tube amp and a guitar.
But,buying a Crate Power block still requires that you go out and get a speaker cabinet of some kind.If tha's in your budget,then it's do-able.
If you were to pick up a fender bassman or something low cost and high powered,and put the pod in front or through the effects loop,it will sound better than the Crate for sure.The choice is yours to make.Effects sound better through a tube amp.Period.that's my opinion.nothing more or nothing less.
 

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I have come across many guys who have tried what you are about to try. A Pod into a tube amp= dissappointing tones. The guitar on its own, with nothing in between, would be more pleasing to the ear. I' m not trying to rain on your thread, but I honestly can't see how you can not find a more toneful solution. Ever try to coax musical feedback with digitzed modelling?? You can`t!! I wouldn`t be able to play like myself without that kind of interaction between amp, guitar and player.

But what do I know??

CT.:wave:
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Adicted to Tubes said:
You've passed the initiation test!Seriously,the Crate power block is a good amplifier in itself and it is designed for the Pod to go into it.You can get any speaker designed for guitar amps,even a PA speaker and it will do what you need it to do.
Yes,we are a bunch of tube heads for sure.But there is a reason.Me in particular,I have gone down the road you are going down now.I used to have an effects processor and a Rack mounted solid state Rexx amplifier.It was plenty good enough for what I was doing with it at the time.As time went on,I 'discovered' tube amps.It really depends what you need.If you play lots of covers,you need effects of some kind.if you play the blues,you need a tube amp and a guitar.
But,buying a Crate Power block still requires that you go out and get a speaker cabinet of some kind.If tha's in your budget,then it's do-able.
If you were to pick up a fender bassman or something low cost and high powered,and put the pod in front or through the effects loop,it will sound better than the Crate for sure.The choice is yours to make.Effects sound better through a tube amp.Period.that's my opinion.nothing more or nothing less.
I was just looking at an ebay auction that included a Crate PowerBlock and Crate 1X12 Celestian cab for about $285 CDN (pre-shipping/customs). I was thinking of trying that and then maybe getting another 112 cab later on, so that I can do the stereo thing, or have an extra speaker for louder gigs.

I agree that if I were playing straight Blues, R&B, etc that a tube amp and guitar would be all I need. Unfortunately, I'm not. I play in an alt-folk-country band and have to play in a variety of styles.

I've tried the pod with several good tube amps. It actually works OK if you turn off the amp models and just use the affects. That said, I still can't afford the $1000.00 or so for what is to me an acceptable tube amp.

I did play a reasonably priced Vox Valvetronic (hybrid) that really sounded quite nice. For the $400 that I'll end up spending on a power block/cab solution, perhaps I should just get the Vox? I don't know.

In any event, thanks for your advice. It's well taken.

Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter #15
CocoTone said:
I have come across many guys who have tried what you are about to try. A Pod into a tube amp= dissappointing tones. The guitar on its own, with nothing in between, would be more pleasing to the ear. I' m not trying to rain on your thread, but I honestly can't see how you can not find a more toneful solution. Ever try to coax musical feedback with digitzed modelling?? You can`t!! I wouldn`t be able to play like myself without that kind of interaction between amp, guitar and player.

But what do I know??

CT.:wave:
I've recently discovered that if you turn off the amp and cab models and just use the POD for it's stomp box and modulation effects, it works fine with a tube amp. Of course, the problem remains that I can't afford the $1000 or so for what is to me an acceptable tube amp.

Actually, it is absolutely possible to get nice, musical feedback through a Pod XT. I do it all the time. The Pod's models were designed to have the same response curves as their name sakes.

For gigs where we have lots of PA headroom, I've had great success just playing the Pod through the P.A.

But as someone else pointed out, so much depends on the style of music that one is playing. I'm not playing Blues. My band's style depends on my ability to get a bunch of more modern tones and the Pod is well suited for that task.

Of course, if the gods lay some big money on me one day, I'll have both a good Tube amp (probably a Fender Twin or Vibrolux) and a POD in my rig.
 

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How many well-respected players, known for their live tone, use a Pod or similar modelling set up?? All I know is, when I want good tone live, I go to a decent tube type amp. Perhaps one day, they will get it so that we don`t know the diff. Until then,,,etc

CT. :food-smiley-004:
 

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Jeff is taking a beating here. A single tube amp doesn't work for him, he plays a wide variety of music. The POD et al. are made for that purpose.

Some of the best cover bands I've heard were using modelers. It wasn't the best tone but they emulated the tone on individual songs closer than any single tube amp could pull off.

Let's try and find a solution for him everyone.
 

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Jeff,
the powerblock is available cheaper than that at local guitar shops in Calgary.I saw it for 249.00 at one of the higher priced stores in town here.I would check and see if L&M sells them.
The Vox Valvtronics is an excellent amp.the only thing is,the 60 watts is not as loud as an 18 watt tube amp.You should try one out at gigging volumes before buying one.I tried one out at my local L&M and it aslo had drastic level differences between effects.One was loud and others were quiet,so I had to row the volume on the amp a lot.
If you are close to a long & Mcquade,they can rent one out to you and you can try before you buy.An excellent way to find out if it's right for you.

www.claramps.com
 

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Discussion Starter #19
CocoTone said:
How many well-respected players, known for their live tone, use a Pod or similar modelling set up?? All I know is, when I want good tone live, I go to a decent tube type amp. Perhaps one day, they will get it so that we don`t know the diff. Until then,,,etc

CT. :food-smiley-004:
Too many to list here. One that springs to mind is Geddy Lee of Rush. You've probably seen the stack of laundry machines that he has behind him on stage. They grew out of a joke about how they would balance the stage look, since the guitarist uses a bunch of Marshall stacks and Geddy plays his bass through a Pod Bass processor.

Then there's Trent Reznor, who runs a rather elaborate Pod setup. Must I go on?

Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks

Jeff Flowerday said:
Jeff is taking a beating here. A single tube amp doesn't work for him, he plays a wide variety of music. The POD et al. are made for that purpose.

Some of the best cover bands I've heard were using modelers. It wasn't the best tone but they emulated the tone on individual songs closer than any single tube amp could pull off.

Let's try and find a solution for him everyone.
Thanks Jeff. That's OK. I expected as much. Like so many things in life, people feel compelled to draw lines in the sand. Tube amps are sort of like underwear. The audience really doesn't give a crap whether or not you're wearing boxers or briefs, so long as your jeans look nice. Its the same with amps. I have yet to hear a listener say "the band was great but that guitar guy obviously isn't using a tube amp...pity".

In the late 70's I played in cover bands for years with nothing more than a Yamaha G100 212 solid state amp and a telecaster. No one ever complained.
In fact, the one time my Yamaha was down and I had to rent an amp, I rented a Twin and then I did get complaints (that my guitarw as way too loud)...

:)

Jeff
 
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