Vibrato - Your Preference [Archive] - GuitarsCanada.com

Hamm Guitars

05-30-2007, 06:05 PM

I voted for the Floyd because I think if you are going to have a guitar with a tremolo on it that you are going to use more than ocasionally (i.e You're a whammy bar freak) there really is no better choice. The Floyd, for all of its faults, is a dependable and capable tremolo system.

That's not to say that a Floyd is the only way to go, but if I only had one guitar and I liked to whammy, it would be the one I'd pick. I personally prefer a hard tail in reality.

fraser

05-30-2007, 07:34 PM

i always use the fender vintage style- 6 screws.
flush and tight against body- i throw the wammy bar away. i honestly cringe anytime i hear somebody using one lol. i prefer the subtlety of a neck bend, or i sometimes grab the upper horn of the guitar and quickly shake the guitar back and forth- or applying tension to the strings behind the nut.

Maxer

05-30-2007, 09:58 PM

That's not to say that a Floyd is the only way to go, but if I only had one guitar and I liked to whammy, it would be the one I'd pick. I personally prefer a hard tail in reality.

I didn't vote... but that said, of all my guitars I have only one dedicated as a tremelo guitar, and that one has a Floyd Rose. If it didn't have that I probably would have an Ibanez with an Edge II or some such (as I understand that these are allegedly even better than the original Floyd design)... simply for the versatility it offers. Nine times out of ten I want a hard-tail supple enough for me to bend all my notes at will; that's my default preference.

Sometimes, however, a guitar equipped with a Floyd is a wonderful thing to have as a recording instrument... a really nice guitar with a floating tremelo can be a very supple thing to work with. I dislike total technical wankery and dive-bombing runs galore, but used judiciously such techniques can add a helluvalot to a composition. You just can't do with the old tremelos what you can with the 'new' ones - the pitch range is far greater, the response far more predictable, the consistency generally far more dependable.

But all the same... most of my tremelo-equipped guitars have been 'fixed' so that the only bending that's happening is with my fingers.

As the saying goes, your mileage may vary.

GuitarsCanada

05-30-2007, 10:13 PM

I kind of like the Bigsby myself. I have a few guitars with them. I find them to be really smooth, if you know what I mean. A lot of range with them. Fairly easy to set up as well, at least that has been my experience.

Ti-Ron

05-30-2007, 10:18 PM

I never used an old fender trem, I will put that on my list to try! For now I have the Fishman's one! For me it perfect. I never use the whammy bar, only push/grab the trem at is base, or sometime hit it very fast with my palm but the bar is useless. I do prefer the stoptail, easier to set with different tuning and no mess up with longs settings. Once I had a Jackson Performer with the Floyd's system and I really hate it. ALways complicated to fix up so I sold it and pass to another thing! That's not my game and I don't shred so no Floyd for me!

bobb

05-30-2007, 10:39 PM

Washburn Wonderbar/Shift 2001. A shortlived 80s relic but still working perfectly. The original selling point for me was that there was no routing required. Simple four bolt top mount on a strat style body that was never routed for a tailpiece.

KHINGPYNN

05-30-2007, 11:14 PM

I like the Music Man Traditional vibrato, PRS and origional Floyd with micro tuners. kahlers a re cool too.

Khing

Budda

05-31-2007, 07:08 AM

i have only had any real experience with the trem on my strat, i dont know how to use one effectively as yet.

suffice it to say, i havent voted :P

Robert1950

05-31-2007, 07:44 AM

The fingers on my left hand.

david henman

05-31-2007, 09:02 AM

...american standard, but only because the upgraded american deluxe isn't listed.

the one on my 86 strat plus works flawlessly.

i've never tried the wilkinson bridge, but hope to one day.

-dh

david henman

05-31-2007, 09:05 AM

i always use the fender vintage style- 6 screws.
flush and tight against body- i throw the wammy bar away. i honestly cringe anytime i hear somebody using one lol.

...so you can't listen to steve vai, joe satriani, hank marvin, jeff beck....etc etc etc....????

-dh

Rumble_b

05-31-2007, 10:51 AM

Two that I've used and really like are the Music Man one and Ibanez SAT pro bridge. A friend has a Ibanez SA with it and the thing just works great.

Jim Jones

05-31-2007, 01:19 PM

Paul Kossoff and Leslie West. Oh wait... :smile:

Jim

allthumbs56

05-31-2007, 03:20 PM

Nicest one was on the Godin I had. I believe it was made by LR Bags. It worked perfectly.

Milkman

05-31-2007, 03:50 PM

You didn't list a Floyd Rose, only a Floyd Rose II.

As it was explained to me, the FR II is a single locking FR and is a pale comparison of the OFR.

I'll take a double locking Floyd or a good licensed version.

The Kicker Of Elves

05-31-2007, 04:07 PM

The fingers on my left hand.

I agree. Fixed bridge for me.

fraser

05-31-2007, 07:47 PM

...so you can't listen to steve vai, joe satriani, hank marvin, jeff beck....etc etc etc....????

-dh

lol- actually im not a fan of any of those guys, so i never listen to them at all
however i do listen to hendrix and srv- thanks david, now im confused

GuitaristZ

05-31-2007, 07:51 PM

The fingers on my left hand.

+1 hardtail all the way

I have 2 guitars with trems, and both of them are blocked :D

Luke98

05-31-2007, 08:35 PM

Dont have any experience with tremolos.. now I have to look into it.

Mooh

06-05-2007, 09:07 AM

I voted vintage Strat, but I like any Strat vibrato, because they feel similar and can be monkeyed with easily (blocked, tremset, etc). The G&L vibratos are nice too.

Second choice would be Bigsby, they have such a cool vibe.

Peace, Mooh.

rideough

06-09-2007, 08:02 AM

Bigsby all the way. It looks the coolest and it just has "something" that the others don't.

chaoscypher

06-09-2007, 10:51 AM

Not a huge fan of the whammy bar myself; but I'll give credit to the guitarists that can use it really effectively.

SinCron

06-09-2007, 11:08 AM

I *heart* string through. Dont think I'll ever get anything with a floyd again.

Gear Pig

06-09-2007, 12:21 PM

lamf

06-10-2007, 07:33 AM

how about the old gibson Lyre maestro its one of my favorites

Neill MacInnis

06-10-2007, 11:42 AM

i like the hipshot bridges.... they feel solid and are heavy enough to get really good warble effects

Robert1950

06-10-2007, 03:09 PM

how about the old gibson Lyre maestro its one of my favorites

I recently heard on another forum that the reissue maestros aren't made quite the same as the old ones and don't recover the same, which can lead to some tuning problems. They were also designed to make finger like vibratos. Dive bombing hadn't even been thought of back then.

GuitarsCanada

06-10-2007, 10:30 PM

Bigsby is leading the way in the poll. Surprising? I really like them myself.

Robert1950

06-10-2007, 10:44 PM

So,... is a Bigsby a better choice on an SG than a Maestro???

david henman

06-12-2007, 07:49 AM

That's a tough one, I love the floyd on my 89 Charvel, the tone of a hard tail, but as of lately I am really loving the dual fulcrum on my G&L Legacy!! I have to admit it is a really nice design, stays in tune and has great tone! MAKE THE VOICES STOP!!!! Hehe
:food-smiley-004:

...this is one vibrato i just don't get. the one on my legacy has caused me no end of trouble. i find it stiff, klunky, extremely difficult to pull up. and, although mine seems to have "settled", at first it was impossible to tune - it just could not find the zero point.

i also find that you have to constantly tighten the plastic bushing that keeps bar from having any play.

and yet, every other g&l player in the world thinks i'm completely out of my mind. is this because, generally speaking, players who buy g&l guitars use the trem bar very moderately?

-dh

Falcatarius

06-25-2007, 07:04 PM

I voted Fender Vintage Tremolo. I find that any other vibrato (possible exception of a Bigsby) cuts natural sustain.

mike7

06-25-2007, 11:02 PM

Original Floyd Rose, Ibanez ZR, Edge, Lo Pro, and Edge Pro are my favorite. If you're going to get a vibrato, might as well go all out. It takes a bit longer to string the guitar and change tunings but its worth it. :rockon:

felenoral

06-28-2007, 09:43 AM

I'm either hardtail or Floyd Rose. Anything in between just doesn't cut it!

david henman

06-28-2007, 10:36 AM

I'm either hardtail or Floyd Rose. Anything in between just doesn't cut it!

...i wonder if that's because you haven't invested the time.

i agree that if you're playing style is more steve vai than hank marvin, locking is probably the way to go.

that said, i have a two-point floating trem on my strat plus that seriously rivals any floyd rose OR hardtail in regard to tuning stability, and doesn't require a doctorate in physics or an extensive tool kit to re-string, set up and maintain.

-dh

Hamm Guitars

06-28-2007, 10:46 AM

...i wonder if that's because you haven't invested the time.

i agree that if you're playing style is more steve vai than hank marvin, locking is probably the way to go.

that said, i have a two-point floating trem on my strat plus that seriously rivals any floyd rose OR hardtail in regard to tuning stability, and doesn't require a doctorate in physics or an extensive tool kit to re-string, set up and maintain.

-dh

You can lock a non-locking tremolo system quite easily. I've been doing it for years on my own personal guitars.

The simple method is described here:

http://guitarscanada.com/Board/showthread.php?t=6180

david henman

06-28-2007, 11:14 AM

You can lock a non-locking tremolo system quite easily. I've been doing it for years on my own personal guitars.

The simple method is described here:

http://guitarscanada.com/Board/showthread.php?t=6180

...the question is, why would you want to?

to me, locking or blocking a trem is like buying a convertible and then converting it to a hard top.

when i want a guitar with the tremolo locked down, i simply pick up a hardtail.

-dh

Hamm Guitars

06-28-2007, 11:29 AM

...the question is, why would you want to?

to me, locking or blocking a trem is like buying a convertible and then converting it to a hard top.

when i want a guitar with the tremolo locked down, i simply pick up a hardtail.

-dh

Locking keeps the strings from slipping on the string sadles when you use the bar. Blocking prevents you from using the bar, locking doesn't.

It is the strings that are locked in place, not the bar. The bar remains 100% usable but has better tuning stability. The only down side is the flubbering effect that all locking trems have.

I've seen locking trems that are esentially temporarily blocked trems, so I understand the confusion in terms.

Here is a pic of what I mean:

http://www.hammguitars.com/guitarscanada/bridgeplugs.JPG

I haven't set up an HLS 2 for myself yet, or I would post a pic of them installed in a guitar.

david henman

06-28-2007, 01:31 PM

Locking keeps the strings from slipping on the string sadles when you use the bar. Blocking prevents you from using the bar, locking doesn't.
It is the strings that are locked in place, not the bar. The bar remains 100% usable but has better tuning stability. The only down side is the flubbering effect that all locking trems have.
I've seen locking trems that are esentially temporarily blocked trems, so I understand the confusion in terms.[/I]

...okay, i need to lie down and:zzz:....

there, better...wait...no...i'm still confused...

-dh

Stratocaster

06-09-2008, 08:14 PM

Ibanez Lo-Pro hands down...I beat the smack out of it everyday and it never goes out of tune lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHuol4VHouQ

Robert1950

06-09-2008, 08:50 PM

The fingers on my left hand.

I bought a strat in January with a vintage 6 pt. vibrato. So I've sort of changed my mind,... well, not quite. I like this vibrato, but still prefer the fingers on my left hand - even though they aren't as good.

Spikezone

06-10-2008, 03:14 AM

I don't use it much, but when I do, the trem on my G&L Legacy NEVER goes out of tune-that's my whammy of choice.
-Mikey

Archer

06-10-2008, 11:13 AM

I have Floyds, Fishmans, vintage Hamer (think PRS before PRS) and wilkinson trems on guitars right now.

All work fine when set up correctly.

I have no preference.

Mogwaii

06-10-2008, 05:02 PM

I've voted Bigsby, but I like the burns also!

CM_X5

06-12-2008, 05:11 PM

I tried a Kahler the other day and loved it, but I hear so many good things about higher end Ibanez trems as well. I gotta try one if I ever get the chance but Ibanez guitars are rare in the guitar store in this city. Nothing but Peaveys and Fenders...

Tycho

06-14-2008, 12:28 PM

aC2rs

06-14-2008, 01:00 PM

My preference is no vibrato which is what I voted for. That said, I own a guitar with a Fender vintage trem and a guitar with a Floyd Rose trem, of those two I prefer the Floyd Rose.

KHINGPYNN

06-14-2008, 01:49 PM

I prefer big b;ock floyds... and the Trans Trem by Steinburger... did I spell that right???

Mooh

06-17-2008, 09:53 AM

I think I originally chose the vintage Strat vibrato, but I've heard, played, and serviced a few Strats lately with the two point bridges and like them a lot. Can't even figure out what the real contributing difference is for feel. Have the two point ones changed without me noticing? I didn't like them at first...maybe it was just refusal to accept something new?

Peace, Mooh.

bluesmostly

06-17-2008, 10:59 AM

[http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v226/Bjumper/gouldclemtrem001.jpg[IMG]

I have a few guitars with springs and 60's type whammy's but and I find my G&L's slightly better than the Fender system. But the Clemtrem rules. It is an ingenious system that is essentially a fixed bridge when not in use. It has no springs but uses a metal rocker system. Stays in tune perfectly, even if you break a string!

Tycho

06-17-2008, 11:03 AM

I should also mention the Les trem that was offered on some Reverends for the past few years. It's like a Bigsby but with much better control. The few I tried felt really great.

However, I believe the guy who made them unfortunately died and Reverend had to stop offering them. But if you can find a Rev that has one, they're worth checking out.

GuitarsCanada

06-19-2008, 08:20 AM

LowWatt

06-19-2008, 11:47 AM

I like Bigsbys and vintage Strat trems, but the Bigsby is a bitch to string up, and my favourite "mild"trem is the Jaguar/Jazzmaster system. An eccentric choice, I know.

I've still never tried a vibrola. I suspect I'd like it, based on the above choices.

Yep. I picked other because my favourite trem is on a Jazzmaster. It's similar to a bigsby, but just a little bit wilder and more dramatic. Perfect trem for the spy-movie type vibrato sounds that I like.

bluesmostly

06-20-2008, 12:16 PM

Interesting. Have not seen one of these before.

I actually went to highschool with the guy that used to make these guitars (Gould). He invented this trem system, but he no longer makes guitars. I bought a couple of his guitars that he had left over just for the trem system, and they are incredibly well made guitars alround.

Milkman

06-20-2008, 12:43 PM

For me it's a double locking Floyd or nothing.

I've tried most designs over the years including some traditional Fender trems that had been set up and tweaked.

It comes down to feel and (hopefully) logic. I'd say most systems can be made to work with proper set up, maintenance and an understanding of the design principles.

Paul

06-20-2008, 01:00 PM

Milkman

06-20-2008, 03:13 PM

I think that the ClemTrem idea is very cool. If it works the way I think it does, yo don't get dive bomb capability, but you will get a smooth vibrato. Return to pitch will be 100% dependant on the nut and tuning machines, as there will be no hysterisis problems on the trem end.

With a double locking Floyd, I would guess that the single biggest component to accuracy would be the knife edge balance point. As long as the balance point is well maintained, the rest of the system should just work. Do I guess right?

I think the knife edges are very important, but I personally think the set up is the most critical element. Improperly set up Roses are probably the biggest reason people bail on them. The design is sound, but it requires understanding and a little basic common sense maintenence saavy.

Paul

06-20-2008, 03:30 PM

I think the knife edges are very important, but I personally think the set up is the most critical element.

Once you have a set that works for you, the set up shouldn't change much, if at all, over time. As long as you maintain humidity control and use the same brand and gauge of strings, the only moving part in a Floyd is the knife edge. To me, that's the part that needs the most intensive preventive and predictive maintenance procedures.

Every time I've played an inconsistent Floyd, it's been the edges that have been mangled.

But what do I know? All but one of my guitars is a hardtail of some kind, and the one trem instrument has 5 springs in it to pull it back tight.

Milkman

06-20-2008, 03:52 PM

Once you have a set that works for you, the set up shouldn't change much, if at all, over time. As long as you maintain humidity control and use the same brand and gauge of strings, the only moving part in a Floyd is the knife edge. To me, that's the part that needs the most intensive preventive and predictive maintenance procedures.

Every time I've played an inconsistent Floyd, it's been the edges that have been mangled.

But what do I know? All but one of my guitars is a hardtail of some kind, and the one trem instrument has 5 springs in it to pull it back tight.

I hear the same from other people, but I think balance is the key with a Floyd. I've had five or six different ones over the years and the cheaper ones wore out a little quicker, but not the knife edges. It was always the screws and the threaded holes in the bridge plate.

I've been able to keep them all stable and intonated. By far the best of the lot is the one I currently have which is a Gotoh. It has design improvements from the original FR and has very high quality materials and workmanship.

bluesmostly

06-20-2008, 07:55 PM

I think that the ClemTrem idea is very cool. If it works the way I think it does, yo don't get dive bomb capability, but you will get a smooth vibrato. Return to pitch will be 100% dependant on the nut and tuning machines, as there will be no hysterisis problems on the trem end.

With a double locking Floyd, I would guess that the single biggest component to accuracy would be the knife edge balance point. As long as the balance point is well maintained, the rest of the system should just work. Do I guess right?

The Clemtrem does have full range dive bomb capability, he designed this during the 80's shred era. It is the smoothest trem system I have ever used, esp. compared to most spring loaded/floating bridge systems. It is locked at the nut and returns to pitch without a problem.

I have never used a FR trem system. Just old fashioned Strat type systems (Including the G&L"s) and 60's spring and bendy metal plate stuff (like on my old firebird) - they are kinda surfy...

Milkman

06-20-2008, 08:29 PM

The Clemtrem does have full range dive bomb capability, he designed this during the 80's shred era. It is the smoothest trem system I have ever used, esp. compared to most spring loaded/floating bridge systems. It is locked at the nut and returns to pitch without a problem.

I have never used a FR trem system. Just old fashioned Strat type systems (Including the G&L"s) and 60's spring and bendy metal plate stuff (like on my old firebird) - they are kinda surfy...

Would you mind explaining how this bridge works? There has to be something to counteract the tension of the strings. Is it a spring steel plate?

bluesmostly

06-21-2008, 03:05 AM

Would you mind explaining how this bridge works? There has to be something to counteract the tension of the strings. Is it a spring steel plate?

Gosh, I would love to Milkman. Problem is, I can't remember. He took one apart for me and showed me how the metal rockers work, sort of like opposing valve cams in a motor as I recall, but that was a while ago and you can't really tell much from looking at it without taking it apart. The bridge is 'fixed' and the string tension doesn't affect that position until you push or pull on the arm, even if you break a string. Sorry, that I am not very tech minded, so that is all I have for ya... He also showed me a stack of letters from patent lawyers wanting to represent him because several guitar makers had stolen his design...

sysexguy

06-21-2008, 12:58 PM

I voted Fender Vintage but more specifically the Callaham version. I have a half dozen different systems and that's the one that allows me the best expression.

FWIW I had a floyd/tremsetter system for most of the big hair days and it was getting on my nerves (sonically)....and then we got in a Suhr Reb Beach which I loved.... (but sold) so I tried just for fun to see what the same guitar without the tremsetter sounded and........like the Wizard of OZ when it goes from b/w to colour......so that guitar's for shred :rockon2:and I need to put it down when I attempt the country oblique bending.

Set up is critical with any trem and when it's all there, it's great. If anyone has a Stetsbar going 100%, please pm me as I'm having some issues.

Andy

Milkman

06-22-2008, 09:18 AM

FWIW I had a floyd/tremsetter system for most of the big hair days and it was getting on my nerves (sonically)....and then we got in a Suhr Reb Beach which I loved.... (but sold) so I tried just for fun to see what the same guitar without the tremsetter sounded and........like the Wizard of OZ when it goes from b/w to colour......so that guitar's for shred :rockon2:and I need to put it down when I attempt the country oblique bending.

Andy

Interesting comments Andy. I agree that FRs with "devices" added to "stabilize" or otherwise interfere with their normal function are pale shadows of the unaltered design. I also don't like them set up to dive only.

I also pick up a Tele or other non-trem guitar when the music is best served by it.

laristotle

06-22-2008, 09:24 AM

I have a Washburn with a licensed FR in it.
It bombs nicely, however, I'm sorta drifting
away from trems. A little neck flex here n'
there is fine for me.

sysexguy

06-22-2008, 10:43 AM

You know I was going there......and then this Scott Henderson guy kept making noise at the Suhr booth:bow: :banana: setting the bar rather high (pardon the pun)

Andy

smorgdonkey

07-02-2008, 08:22 AM

Why is Floyd Rose not on the list but Floyd Rose II is on the list?

Original Floyd Rose for me.

KHINGPYNN

07-02-2008, 02:53 PM

...this is one vibrato i just don't get. the one on my legacy has caused me no end of trouble. i find it stiff, klunky, extremely difficult to pull up. and, although mine seems to have "settled", at first it was impossible to tune - it just could not find the zero point.

i also find that you have to constantly tighten the plastic bushing that keeps bar from having any play.

and yet, every other g&l player in the world thinks i'm completely out of my mind. is this because, generally speaking, players who buy g&l guitars use the trem bar very moderately?

Of all the trems I've set up that are dual knife edge fulcrum the G&L was the one i liked the feel of the least and required the most work to get it performing within in reason. The Music man is a far better palying and sounding trem IMHO.

Also I'd like to touch on the "oblique bends" with a FR or any other dual knife edge fulcrum trem.
I have always adjusted my playing for FR trems when it comes to oblique bends... ie; raising the pitch of the ( usually ) unbent string to keep it in tune by bending it slightly to raise the pitch... origionally it was my ear that found the flaw then I made up for it with my fingers.
Anyone else doing this to overcome intonation problems with a FR trem??? Other than that and if you break a string with a FR which causes mahem... I really like Origional FR and Big Block FR trems.

bluesmostly

07-02-2008, 11:13 PM

Of all the trems I've set up that are dual knife edge fulcrum the G&L was the one i liked the feel of the least and required the most work to get it performing within in reason. The Music man is a far better palying and sounding trem IMHO.

Also I'd like to touch on the "oblique bends" with a FR or any other dual knife edge fulcrum trem.
I have always adjusted my playing for FR trems when it comes to oblique bends... ie; raising the pitch of the ( usually ) unbent string to keep it in tune by bending it slightly to raise the pitch... origionally it was my ear that found the flaw then I made up for it with my fingers.
Anyone else doing this to overcome intonation problems with a FR trem??? Other than that and if you break a string with a FR which causes mahem... I really like Origional FR and Big Block FR trems.

I found my G&L Legacy trem a slight improvement over my Fender, stayed in tune a bit better. I don't like either very much. I do have to keep tightening the little screw to keep the arm from flopping around too...

I like your 'sig lick' K.

Milkman

07-03-2008, 07:53 AM

Of all the trems I've set up that are dual knife edge fulcrum the G&L was the one i liked the feel of the least and required the most work to get it performing within in reason. The Music man is a far better palying and sounding trem IMHO.

Also I'd like to touch on the "oblique bends" with a FR or any other dual knife edge fulcrum trem.
I have always adjusted my playing for FR trems when it comes to oblique bends... ie; raising the pitch of the ( usually ) unbent string to keep it in tune by bending it slightly to raise the pitch... origionally it was my ear that found the flaw then I made up for it with my fingers.
Anyone else doing this to overcome intonation problems with a FR trem??? Other than that and if you break a string with a FR which causes mahem... I really like Origional FR and Big Block FR trems.

Yes I have always made the same adjustment to my playing, even with Kahlers which have the same problem. It's an instinctive habit and although it's still a comprimise, it does allow you to do double stops with bends and keep them in tune.

Obviously if you play a style that encorporates that sort of thing a lot you probably should be playing a Tele or similar.

Breaking a string with a floating system means you put the guitar down and pick up your back up, however if you change your strings as often as I do you probably almost NEVER break strings. I may have broken two or three in ten years, if that.